Savage Pacer - Tragic bus accident caused by an illegal alien without a valid drivers license - Comments

More proof in this Star

Savage Guy — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 12:37:42 -0500

More proof in this Star Tribune article that more needs to be done to stop illegal immigration. The problem can't be solved if we keep failing to stop illegal aliens from getting in to the country.

http://www.startribune.com/local/18403589.html

I see one of Senator Norm

Savage Guy — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 13:39:35 -0500

I see one of Senator Norm Coleman's planks in his re-election platform is to eliminate so-called sanctuary cities. Hurray for Senator Coleman! There should be no city or town that is able to prevent their police officers from helping to detain and deport illegal aliens. There are plenty of people waiting in line to come in to the country legally. Those who do so illegally should be punished under the law. Also, people and companies who employ illegal aliens should be punished under the law. If the demand for the cheap labor dried up, there would be less incentive to come here illegally.

Fact of the matter is, no

Nancy Huddleston — Wed, 05 Mar 2008 12:58:35 -0600

Fact of the matter is, no one knows what's going to happen at any given point, which is what I think Lori was getting at in the first place.

Thank you for the

Savage Guy — Wed, 05 Mar 2008 12:37:14 -0600

Thank you for the clarification, but I don't need a deep, calming breath. The context of what you wrote suggested to me that you were talking about "us", not just "you". Now I know differently.

As Robert T. points out, your argument seems to suggest we do nothing about anything because someone else would step in and commit the sin. Pretty faulty logic especially in this case where it's quite a stretch to suggest that someone else would have rammed that bus on that day and killed those kids.

Savage Guy, please take a

Lori Carlson — Wed, 05 Mar 2008 12:18:56 -0600

Savage Guy, please take a deep, calming breath and re-read my post.
I said "I" would prefer not to discuss the immigration issue. "I."
My reason: The nature of my job. I'd prefer to remain neutral about highly political issues on this site.
I never said you or anyone else shouldn't discuss them.

I didn't see the sign when I

Savage Guy — Wed, 05 Mar 2008 07:47:08 -0600

I didn't see the sign when I first came to savagepacer.com that said "please do not discuss immigration on this web site". Lori, are there other topics you would prefer we not discuss on this web site? Stick to the safe stuff, is that what you are saying? It's okay for Schardin and Nesvig to write their liberal rants against President Bush but if us citizens want to discuss other important political topics, that's off limits?!?

Lori, Based on that logic

Robert Thibodeaux — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 14:38:12 -0600

Lori,
Based on that logic (another driver could have done), we should bother being concerned with drunk driving - because someone else driving badly could have caused an accident.

And the immigration debate is very important to Savage and Scott county.
If you have a chance talk with some of the Scott County Sheriffs or the Attorney's office, they will tell you about the stories of the negative impact of illegal immigration on the area from crime to drugs.

It is also a big concern here in this area because we have such a strong legal immigrant community that deserve respect for following the law. And we should be enforcing the rules they obeyed as a sign of that respect.

If there's a will there's a

Nancy Huddleston — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 14:13:11 -0600

If there's a will there's a way ... it's human nature. If someone wants to drive without a license they will -- no matter if they don't have a license because they've been ticketed multiple times for drunk driving, had too many speeding tickets or because they are an illegal immigrant. I agree, there's something seriously wrong with the system if cops in Minneapolis and St. Paul cannot ask a driver their legal status because they are in some imaginary "santuary." Unfortunately, we all let the children on that school bus in Cottonwood down.

I'm not arguing your point

Lori Carlson — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 14:10:56 -0600

I'm not arguing your point that had the woman been stopped earlier she wouldn't have been around to cause the crash. I'd prefer to stay out of the immigration debate on this Web site.
I'm simply saying, if it wasn't that particular woman who hit the bus, it's just as likely someone else - someone drunk or high or otherwise unqualified to drive who IS a citizen of this country - could have taken her place.

Exactly, it's a simple

Savage Guy — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 13:26:33 -0600

Exactly, it's a simple matter of cause and effect. If she were not in the country, those kids would still be alive.

The fact that she is an illegal alien makes the deaths that much more cruel because it would not have happened if she had been deported when she was cited for no license two years earlier. Now you have finger pointing going on between local law enforcement and federal immigration officials with both sides blaming the other for the lack of deporting of discovered illegal aliens. They had better start working together going forward.

Lori, It is because if any

Robert Thibodeaux — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 13:18:41 -0600

Lori,

It is because if any of the multiple times she was stopped someone had called ICE, she would not have been in the state of MN, not been in cottonwood and not run into that bus.

I really can't believe this

Lori Carlson — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 12:41:22 -0600

I really can't believe this case is being blamed on a person's lack of citizenship. Blame it on the person's lack of a driver's license, driving ability, drinking/drugs/whatever. But what exactly does being a citizen of the United States or not being a citizen of the United States have to do with this woman causing this accident? It doesn't matter which side of the immigration fence you're on. The simple fact is, people who are citizens of this country drive without licenses, drive drunk, etc., too. And there are far more of them.

Yes, Morgan's vote was

Savage Guy — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 09:05:34 -0600

Yes, Morgan's vote was essentially a swing vote as the proposal failed by only one vote. The proposal would have withheld state government aid from cities that prohibit police from checking the immigration status of people. It was rejected 67 to 66. There is another proposal in the House that would prohibit cities from barring officials from cooperating with federal agents on immigration investigations. Call your legislators and tell them how you feel!

Will Morgan Supports Illegal

Robert Thibodeaux — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 20:26:54 -0600

Will Morgan Supports Illegal Immigration -

Today in the house in addition to voting against property tax relief, Will Morgan also voted against preventing "sanctuary cities".

Interesting as I was having dinner they were interviewing police officers in border states who were begging their cities to allow them to call ICE.
But in MN they get no such support.
Apparently Will thinks it is more important to keep these folks on the road.

Thanks Will.

Not to disagree Lori, but

Robert Thibodeaux — Mon, 03 Mar 2008 20:23:59 -0600

Not to disagree Lori, but actually that even proves my point further.

I don't think you are implying that since we have implemented stronger DUI law and enforcement that rates have gone down (I don't have the stats handy now, but can get them). But you are correct that after you increase enforcement, you reach a point of diminishing returns no matter how much money you throw at an issue.

But I am sure that you would agree that if Savage were to pass a DUI sanctuary law - where if you were stopped in Savage for reckless driving that the officers were prevented from inquiring about you consumption, that it would not decrease the number of people driving while intoxicated?

The problem is not with the Police, but with the bureaucrats and judges who are not caring out the enforcement and incarceration on both these issues.

Tragic bus accident caused by an illegal alien without a valid drivers license

Savage Guy — Thu, 21 Feb 2008 09:13:52 -0600

According to this story in the Star Tribune today, the driver of the van that hit the school bus did not have a license. http://www.startribune.com/local/15823132.html